Mark gets chatty with two of the guys behind Bizarre's new blaster...
Right, first off, Names and job titles, if you will please gents?
Pete: Pete Collier, Level Designer for The Club. Been at Bizarre
Creations for four years now.
Ben: Ben Ward, Web and Community Leader at Bizarre Creations. I deal
with web community, PR and marketing.
What have you two been working on in The Club specifically?
Pete: I was one of four level designers, each assigned two levels. I
made the level design and gameplay for singelplayer and multiplayer aspects of the Steel
Mill and the Manor House.
Ben: And I've been working out how to describe The Club. It's easy
when you've got videos and demos to present, but in text it's difficult saying 'it's like
Tony Hawk's / PGR / Street Fighter' … people are just like 'what?'
Pete: You really need to play The Club to understand it.
Ben: It's been one of the most challenging things; getting across
that The Club isn't your Gears of War story-based game – it's something completely
new.
And how would you define The Club?
Ben: A score-based third-person shooter would be the best way of
describing it.
Pete: I like to think of it as an Arcade Shooter. The Club is
arcade-based, you're trying to beat your mates scores; it's not a story game in any way
really.
Ben: Fundamentally, The Club's a racing game with guns; the bad guys
are corners and you're the car, running around; taking these guys out in the most stylish
way possible just like corners in PGR. But we've got a roster of characters to play as
like in a Beat 'Em Up.
Pete: The Club is essentially about getting through the level, but to
get the top scores you need to be really, really strategic.
Racers of course are what you're famous for – so why a shooter?
Both: We sat round the table, and everyone agreed they wanted to do one!
[laughs]
Ben: Racing games are great and we're going to continue making them,
that's our bread and butter – but it's healthy for a company to branch out.
Pete: It was also to prove we could do; everyone was labelling us
Bizarre Creations: Racing Studio, but we're gamers too and we were all like 'yeah but, we
like shooters as well!' So it was to prove that we could do that really. Our last stab
was Fur Fighters, but that didn't really see as much of the world as we'd wanted.
Ben: We know we can do shooters, but we wanted to bring that triple-A
experience that we have to it – even down to sharing technology like weather effects and
pooling technology to prove we can do something other than a racing game engine.
The Club's a racing game with guns; the bad guys are corners
and you're the car, running around; taking these guys out in the most stylish way
possible just like corners in PGR.
What's the difference, the switch, between making racers to making
shooters?
Ben: It wasn't really a switch. Internally we've got two teams, and
the team that worked on The Club have been working on a lot of concepts, but only a few
of the Project Gotham team have come over to The Club. It's been more about sharing than
switching.
Pete: I was one of those that came from 'Gotham across to The Club.
There's been a lot of cross-discipline.
Ben: It was when we signed for Sega that we started to swap coders
and artists about, but we've continued two separate streams working on different projects
with a lot of shared tech – so that our games can all use the same weather effects,
lighting, etc. It's a lot harder than it sounds. We've been working on our shared tech
since PGR3 and making it all fit together is really difficult, but it's done now.
Hopefully it will bear well for our future projects.
We'll get to future projects later. First I wanted to ask what you think are
the problems with the shooter genre in particular?
Pete: We need more decapitations! [both laugh]
Pete: I think one of its biggest problems are its successes. Pretty
much all shooters are story-based, and they're great – BioShock is awesome – but we
wanted to do something different with The Club's whole addictive point-scoring arcade
element. You can't go back after the pub and play BioShock with your mates; it's much
better to have a pass-the-pad game.
Ben: I don't think there's anything wrong with shooters, we've just
carved our own niche, in the same way we did with 'Gotham. We looked at racers and thought
'how do we do our own thing?' We've done same sort of thing with The Club and shooters,
looking at Gears of War and Halo and the like.
Pete [To Ben]: Do you think maybe there's an underdog element
to us? So many companies producing these big epic shooters and then there's us, trying
something different and just wanting to produce something cool?
Ben: I think you can only call yourself an underdog when you win –
let's see how it goes! [laughs]. It's really about finding something new. If we
were trying to compete directly with Call of Duty, I'd be a bit nervous.
Funnily enough that goes right into my next question. How was making The Club
different to another developer making a normal shooter?
Pete: Other games are very linear. With shooters there's a timeline,
dialogue – you start with the story. With The Club we started with gameplay and then
built everything else out from that.
Ben: We used our racing game expertise to build things how we build
them from a racer and then took it across to The Club. We built the levels before the
story. It's not necessarily how other people would build game environments.
Pete: It's not like with 'Gotham in copying a city, it's been more
about us level designers collaborating closely with the artists to take environments like
a real-life Manor House and make them fun to play.
Ben: I don't know if that's the best way of doing it, but it's the
way we knew how, so it's how we went about it. The Club is out first massive shooting
game and we've learned a lot from it, so next time maybe we can do something different,
but with The Club it's been good to stick to what we know.
Apart from Gotham, what titles would you say have been your inspiration – and
competition?
Ben: We don't really think of it in terms of competition, we just
think 'how can we make our game the best it can be'.
Pete: There's tons of inspiration though. For instance the bonus
target you have to shoot is based on the little guy from Space Invaders...
Ben [To Pete]: I thought he was based on the guy from Virtua
Cop?
Pete: Ah, but maybe the Virtua Cop guy was based on Space Invaders!
[laughs]
Ben: The one I thought was pretty cool was Doom speed runs – all
these guys trying to get through the level as fast as possible – that's what The Club is
all about.
Pete: The Club's entire premise is based around that male competition
thing; wanting to beat your mate's score. There is story, but it's not the reason to
play.
Ben: It's the flavour, not the lollypop! [laughs]
The Club's entire premise is based around that male
competition thing; wanting to beat your mate's score. There is story, but it's not the
reason to play.
Speaking of wanting to beat your mates… multiplayer. Loads of huge shooters
out there… CoD4, Halo 3, Gears of War with a similar third-person perspective… what makes
The Club stand out?
Pete: The Club's got very unique modes. We've got our own take on
standard ones, killmatch is deathmatch, but we've introduced our own team foxhunt and
team siege, which are loosely based on popular FPS gametypes, but the scoring system puts
our own spin on them.
Ben: In most multiplayer games you play for kills, not score – you
don't worry about getting head shots too much because you've still got a kill.
Pete: You get more points for headshots in The Club. There really is
an emphasis on not just killing someone, but killing them with style.
Ben: The other thing is that we've got eight different characters who
all play differently – some are fast, some absorb bullets...
Pete: It adds a strategic element to teamplay too. Dragov goes in
front, a weaker character cowers behind and fires off rounds...
Ben: There's certainly a lot of originality there; we've added a lot
of game modes and gameplay elements to make it interesting for multiplayer.
Pete: A lot of it is based around us being gamers and wanting to put
in modes that we'd want to play. Team Siege is just really good fun holding off the other
team.
The Club sounds a pretty complete package!
Pete: We'd like to think so!
Ben: That's what the marketing people would say! [laughs]
So what next for Bizarre?
Ben: We've just signed for Activision, which means we've gone from
being the independent developer, working with Sega and Microsoft, to being the favoured
internal developer. Doesn't sound like much, but for us it means we get first dibs on
things we wouldn't have been considered for before, from technology to marketing. It's
really exciting.
Pete: It means getting back to just making games rather than
business. We want to make good games and not worry about the bottom line.
Ben: Activision will worry about the money side of things and let us
get on with making quality games, so
everyone's happy. There's not been much change, we've just got more support. We're
working on a racing game which hasn't got a name or been finalised, so it'll be some way
off. The team behind The Club are working on something else, but we can't talk about that
yet – and we've a few other small projects which we can't go into detail on, but
hopefully we can soon.
Pete: They'll be expanding on the skills we've learned already.
Ben: So no beat 'em ups! [laughs] It's a bit frustrating not
being able to talk about it, but exciting at the same time. We think you'll all be
pleasantly surprised!
Thanks guys.
Interview by: Mark 'Shoot First, Think
Later' Scott
Interview Published: 21.02.08